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What are the implications??? or I don't understand?
I had a new client today. She told me that her right shoulder always hurts...She had surgery on it last year, but it still hurts, and that nothing changed sense the surgery. I said well where does it hurt.. She said they operated on the front of her shoulder but she always felt it was coming from the back of her shoulder... I palpated her infraspinatus and she had a huge nocioceptive response..she jumped and let out a loud OUCH...I asked her if she had any type of therapy prior to the surgery last year... She said that she had four and a half months of chiropractic and massage with no results..same pain..nothing changed... I asked her if any of the massage therapists or the chiropractor that worked on her ever touched her there... She said NO. I asked her if the Medical doctor touched her there..She said No. I asked her if after the surgery if she had any physical therapy..She said yes...I asked her if the physical therapist ever touched her on that spot...She said yes. I asked her if she jumped and screamed like she did when I touched that spot..She said yes. I said what did he do about it... She said he just gave her exercises to do. I released that infraspinatus trigger point in 30 seconds.. On firm re palpation it wasnt there any more...she didnt jump or flinch.. She said I feel no pain. Its gone. I will see her again next week. But its gone.
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Gordon J. Wallis on
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the more you do your work.. the better you get at it...thats whats cool.
Therese Schwartz said:I know what you mean Gordon! It's a really good feeling, and worth sharing.
Can't remember if I've posted about this or not...a really good friend of ours has a little autistic boy who just turned 6. I've been doing CranioSacral Therapy on him, and the changes in him are exciting! His teachers at school have noticed the differences. His mom is so happy. I never wanted to work on kids but there is nothing like being able to improve the life of a child. I didn't charge her for the first 8 sessions or so - it wasn't about the $$ at all. It's changing me too, and definitely for the better.
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whats MLD ?
Gary W Addis said:I've experienced a sweet taste of your experience. A grandnephew in town with parents for a visit had been hurting for a couple of weeks with a shoulder injury--catching himself in a fall he had apparently over stretched stuff. A doctor had injected cortisol that helped only a few hours if that, a physical therapist had stretched the already overstretched joint.
I reached deep into the boy's armpit, found the tender spot near the underside of the scapula (not sure if it was subscapularis tendon or serratus or possibly latissimus tendon--whatever). I pressed into it for about ten seconds hard enough to cause a grimace. Then slowly released. He was amazed that it no longer hurt. Relieving the child's pain felt really good.
I have used a novice's MLD on swollen tissue due to an old injury (no redness, no pain, too large to be thrombosis, no pitting edema). I was very gentle, just encircled the lower leg with both hands and brushed upward as I have seen them do in videos. The next day she called to say the swelling was down a bit. Now, I am certain I didn't do it right--but I didn't hurt anything, and she reports that it seemed to help.
Lots of edema due to surgeries, cancer treatments, etc , and to my knowledge no locals trained in MLD. Another modality I want to study someday.
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Permalink Reply by Therese Schwartz on
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Hey Gordon, I have a question for you. I just talked to a new client an hour ago; she's coming tomorrow. She has serious shoulder pain, left shoulder (it keeps dislocating, and the physical therapists are making it hurt worse). She has a pin in her right shoulder. It hurts for her to breathe; I suggested that she may have a rib out of place. She said she's had that in the past. It hurts to turn her head. And she's on dialysis; 5'3" tall and 113 pounds. I have a plan formulating but what would you do if she came to you?
Gary - good work!!
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Well.. its like impossible for me to give you specific advice about how to work on her without ever actually being with her...But with that being said....all I do on anyone is look for tender areas on the body...and do whatever I can to make those tender areas go away....and if I can do that..more often then naught,.whatever presenting symptoms they have just just go away...Thats my approach on everyone... And I dont think in terms of ribs going out...maybe they do...but id look for a sore spot or tender area maybe in the serrats or intercostals.... thats how I look at things....My perspective....
Therese Schwartz said:Hey Gordon, I have a question for you. I just talked to a new client an hour ago; she's coming tomorrow. She has serious shoulder pain, left shoulder (it keeps dislocating, and the physical therapists are making it hurt worse). She has a pin in her right shoulder. It hurts for her to breathe; I suggested that she may have a rib out of place. She said she's had that in the past. It hurts to turn her head. And she's on dialysis; 5'3" tall and 113 pounds. I have a plan formulating but what would you do if she came to you?
Gary - good work!!
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Thanks Gordon - I can do that, I needed to post something about it because I'm a little hesitant because of all of her issues. Intercostals is a good idea.
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Permalink Reply by Stephen Jeffrey on
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More here Gary :)
http://www.massageprofessionals.com/group/anatomyandphysiologygroup...
Gary W Addis said:Off topic, but something I found interesting.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=QD82pKNFnPE&am...
Videos called "Strolling Under the Skin". Actual filming inside living tissue--fantastic
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I started doing sports massage for my fellow running club members 14 yrs ago now I am doing triggerpoint work daily, you just never know where this profession can lead you. Love every day :)
Therese Schwartz said:I know what you mean Gordon! It's a really good feeling, and worth sharing.
Can't remember if I've posted about this or not...a really good friend of ours has a little autistic boy who just turned 6. I've been doing CranioSacral Therapy on him, and the changes in him are exciting! His teachers at school have noticed the differences. His mom is so happy. I never wanted to work on kids but there is nothing like being able to improve the life of a child. I didn't charge her for the first 8 sessions or so - it wasn't about the $$ at all. It's changing me too, and definitely for the better.
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yea.. you just keep evolving. Perspectives can change.. Its way cool. Thats why when I say stuff in here....Its good to think about because ive been doing it so long.. But its probably not the ultimate truth. Just my truth at the moment... Stephen.. You do have the look of a runner.
Stephen Jeffrey said:I started doing sports massage for my fellow running club members 14 yrs ago now I am doing triggerpoint work daily, you just never know where this profession can lead you. Love every day :)
Therese Schwartz said:I know what you mean Gordon! It's a really good feeling, and worth sharing.
Can't remember if I've posted about this or not...a really good friend of ours has a little autistic boy who just turned 6. I've been doing CranioSacral Therapy on him, and the changes in him are exciting! His teachers at school have noticed the differences. His mom is so happy. I never wanted to work on kids but there is nothing like being able to improve the life of a child. I didn't charge her for the first 8 sessions or so - it wasn't about the $$ at all. It's changing me too, and definitely for the better.
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Permalink Reply by Gary W Addis, LMT on
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MLD = manual lymph drainage. "amount of pressure it takes to move a nickel on a table" used to move lymph through the lymph system. Done badly, it can cause real problems if, say, a lymph node has been removed due to cancer.
Gordon J. Wallis said:whats MLD ?
Gary W Addis said:I've experienced a sweet taste of your experience. A grandnephew in town with parents for a visit had been hurting for a couple of weeks with a shoulder injury--catching himself in a fall he had apparently over stretched stuff. A doctor had injected cortisol that helped only a few hours if that, a physical therapist had stretched the already overstretched joint.
I reached deep into the boy's armpit, found the tender spot near the underside of the scapula (not sure if it was subscapularis tendon or serratus or possibly latissimus tendon--whatever). I pressed into it for about ten seconds hard enough to cause a grimace. Then slowly released. He was amazed that it no longer hurt. Relieving the child's pain felt really good.
I have used a novice's MLD on swollen tissue due to an old injury (no redness, no pain, too large to be thrombosis, no pitting edema). I was very gentle, just encircled the lower leg with both hands and brushed upward as I have seen them do in videos. The next day she called to say the swelling was down a bit. Now, I am certain I didn't do it right--but I didn't hurt anything, and she reports that it seemed to help.
Lots of edema due to surgeries, cancer treatments, etc , and to my knowledge no locals trained in MLD. Another modality I want to study someday.
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The PTs are stretching a joint that is prone to dislocate???? are they idiots?
Regarding the painful to breathe, the medical student I mentioned had that problem; as Gordon suggests, she had a TP, probably serratus anterior
Therese Schwartz said:Hey Gordon, I have a question for you. I just talked to a new client an hour ago; she's coming tomorrow. She has serious shoulder pain, left shoulder (it keeps dislocating, and the physical therapists are making it hurt worse). She has a pin in her right shoulder. It hurts for her to breathe; I suggested that she may have a rib out of place. She said she's had that in the past. It hurts to turn her head. And she's on dialysis; 5'3" tall and 113 pounds. I have a plan formulating but what would you do if she came to you?
Gary - good work!!
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I'm not sure exactly what they are doing with her but this won't be the first time I've had people show up with complications from PT. Thanks - I will definitely check serratus anterior!
Gary, you are so right. In my LDT 1 (Lymph Drainage Therapy) class they heavily stressed that to work on someone without an intact lymph system a therapist must be Lymphedema certified. It wasn't a question - you just don't do it.
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I think you'd need to know where and how to move the lymph away from damaged lymph nodes.
Kinda like all the massage schools teaching to work the gut clockwise as an aid to digestion, beginning at the ileocecal valve. First time I watched a demo of that it occurred to me that if there's constipation, moving the stuff toward the rectum w/o first clearing a space ahead could make the constipation worse. So, when I work the gut (clockwise) I begin low on the left barely above the rectum, then lift my hands, reposition to the right and inch to the left again, filling the now empty space..inching backward toward the small intestine. To me, that's just commonsense.
That's the way you were taught in your class to move the lymph by first making space ahead-- don't begin at the edema b/c the lymph fluid has nowhere to go. I'm sure I didn't explain it very well.
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